LebGeeks

nuclearcat

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

About bandwidth limitations, from my mails, 2 messages

> Venice Project would break many users' ISP conditions
>
> OUT-LAW News, 03/01/2007
>
> Internet television system The Venice Project could break users' monthly
> internet bandwith limits in hours, according to the team behind it.
>
> It downloads 320 megabytes (MB) per hour from users' computers, meaning
> that users could reach their monthly download limits in hours and that it
> could be unusable for bandwidth-capped users.
>
> The Venice Project is the new system being developed by Janus Friis and
> Niklas ZennstrЖm, the Scandinavian entrepreneurs behind the revolutionary
> services Kazaa and Skype. It is currently being used by 6,000 beta testers
> and is due to be launched next year.
>
> The data transfer rate is revealed in the documentation sent to beta
> testers and the instructions make it very clear what the bandwidth
> requirements are so that users are not caught out.
>
> Under a banner saying 'Important notice for users with limits on their
> internet usage', the document says: "The Venice Project is a streaming
> video application, and so uses a relatively high amount of bandwidth per
> hour. One hour of viewing is 320MB downloaded and 105 Megabytes uploaded,
> which means that it will exhaust a 1 Gigabyte cap in 10 hours. Also, the
> application continues to run in the background after you close the main
> window."
>
> "For this reason, if you pay for your bandwidth usage per megabyte or have
> your usage capped by your ISP, you should be careful to always exit the
> Venice Project client completely when you are finished watching it," says
> the document
>
> Many ISPs offer broadband connections which are unlimited to use by time,
> but have limits on the amount of data that can be transferred over the
> connection each month. Though limits are 'advisory' and not strict, users
> who regularly far exceed the limits break the terms of their deals.
>
> BT's most basic broadband package BT Total Broadband Package 1, for
> example, has a 2GB monthly 'usage guideline'. This would be reached after
> 20 hours of viewing.
>
> The software is also likely to transfer data even when not being used. The
> Venice system is going to run on a peer-to-peer (P2P) network, which means
> that users host and send the programmes to other users in an automated
> system.
>
> OUT-LAW has seen screenshots from the system and talked to one of the
> testers of it, who reports very favourably on its use. "This is going to
> be the one. I've used some of the other software out there and it's fine,
> but my dad could use this, they've just got it right," he said. "It looks
> great, you fire it up and in two minutes you're live, you're watching
> television."
>
> The source said that claims being made for the system being "near high
> definition" in terms of picture quality are wide of the mark. "It's not
> high definition. It's the same as normal television," he said.

and some ISP, USA... "where internet is cheap"

I guess the good thing is that almost no one has the ability to actually
deliver this today.  Not to the masses anyway.

Heck, I had ONE user download 2 to 3 movies per day kill an ap till I
figured out who it was and what they were doing.

AOL has put in fair use policies, Sat. TV already had one (based on data
transfer volumes), many cable systems have transfer limits.

The cost of connectivity will have to tall to pennies per meg to make this a
reality for people.  Sure it'll be nice but it still has to fall into
certain price points for folks.

Padre

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

lol and ? ;)

teodorgeorgiev

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

@nuclearcat: how come you guys are the only one offering DSL to corporate customers?? i called all the other isps (idm, cyberia...) and you are the only ones who are offering DSL.
i found that very weird. any feedback on that?

Karim,

I am very astonished and insulted by your question in person!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ON THE BASE OF WHAT do you put us and the other ISPs on the same track ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

The other's tech staff are second-hand people, street people... collected from "here and there".

You know arabs much better than me - two left hands and one biiiiig mouth.

They are good in bribing, lying, paying to hostile teenagers to DoS-attack us from hacked
korean or australian servers, bullshitting (they call it "marketing"), spamming (yes, refer to TerraNet and Mr. Wassim Abou-Rjaily)... 

We have had experience with xDSL from before, both as customers and working in ISPs.
It took us one day to install and configure the DSL core network.

For your information, the others still investigate how that DSL must work... They mostly
rely on outside tech consultants.
One of the ISPs even purchased a DSLAM, but looks like they still can't make it running.

One year before, when we started to implement the ADSL network, we invited everyone to
come and see our installations and noted that it would be good if the other ISPs reveal
their ADSL network infrastructure. Because at that time they had NOTHING but the
usual tools "two left hands and one biiig mouth".

I am ready to face technically all the networking and telecom "engineers" of Lebanon technically. Starting from Ogero, Alfa, IDM, Terra... ...  whatever you want - TCP/IP networking, X.25, Cisco, Linux, telephone switching and signalling systems.

I saw how much do they know. Like the villagers of Alfa, who route some of their
international calls via a low-quality VoIP carrier that gives false supervisory signals thus
resulting in charging for non-answered calls.

Your question sounds so odd, like: "While the Bentley has a leather saloon, but the Daewoo Racer does not ???"

Padre

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

ok, Amen to that teo :)
100% right about tech ppl
200% right bout mouth hand bullshit
300% right about marketing and ignorance.

now tell me how do i get paid to DDoS ;)
i didn't know ISP's in leb do that, but im not really surprised tho.

dont know much about VISP, but i could know, if u answer my PM

Halo

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

Can you kind of explain the night download rules? It's like if I get a 512 connection premium, I have a 5 gig limit for downloading at peak times and a 15 gig limit for downlaoding at night? Is it like that?

Halo

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

BTW, isn't VISP broadband supposed to be like for one user only? We called today and they said that we need 3 people in our building. Also, on the website it says we can try it for 30 days, right? Well we can called they said we can't. I just want to know that if we did get 3 people, would my speed be affected?

rolf

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

BTW, isn't VISP broadband supposed to be like for one user only? We called today and they said that we need 3 people in our building. Also, on the website it says we can try it for 30 days, right? Well we can called they said we can't. I just want to know that if we did get 3 people, would my speed be affected?

by 3 people they mean 3 different subscriber with an account each. Speed is not affected.

Halo

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

And do we all pay 33o bucks for the equipment or do we split the price each?

Padre

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

night download: everything you download during the night period is divided by 3. you download 3meg, you quota will only decrease by 1meg.

rolf

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

And do we all pay 33o bucks for the equipment or do we split the price each?

You pay what they ask you to pay :)
But anyway who told u 330 bucks? That is way above the standard price for a GDS connection.

Last edited by rolf (January 11 2007)

nuclearcat

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

330 bucks - installation fee, it will be divided between customers.
Then - broadband account, listed on website, your choice...

Halo

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

Oh okay because we were freaking out here we thought each of us had to pay 330 dollars.

What about the 30 day no risk trial?

I'm thinking on getting Wise, but I want to know, which connection would have a better latency, Wise or VISP?

Also, I'm recording how much bandwith I use this month so I can know what I should buy from Wise ( if I do get it )

mir

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

Also, I'm recording how much bandwith I use this month

recording.like writing every download
isn't ther a software for that ?

Halo

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

I'm just writing it on notepad, I'm using dial-up so I see how much KB I've used while browsing / downloading during each time I dial / connect, then after I finish, I record how much KB I've used and disconnect

rolf

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

I'm thinking on getting Wise, but I want to know, which connection would have a better latency, Wise or VISP?

If you had read this thread you'd have known that wise got a better latency.
No offence intended :)

Halo

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

Yeah but I read a message that Padre said that he was sure that VISP has got same or even better latency.

I really wish Wise wasn't limited though, it would be nice if they had broadband 128, 256, and 512 connections like the other isp's.

Padre, you play online with Wise? When you do, do you ever go over the limitation?

Also, anyone know anything about Sodetel?

I'm still kind of leaning on VISP, it's the only one that I'm sure I can get because they said they got it in my area, I haven't called Wise and I've called Sodetel like 6 months ago and they said they didn't have internet in my area yet...

mahdoum

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

I'm just writing it on notepad, I'm using dial-up so I see how much KB I've used while browsing / downloading during each time I dial / connect, then after I finish, I record how much KB I've used and disconnect

The faster the internet the more you will browse and eventually the more you will download, so don't rely solely on your current bandwidth.

nuclearcat

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

Oh okay because we were freaking out here we thought each of us had to pay 330 dollars.

What about the 30 day no risk trial?

I'm thinking on getting Wise, but I want to know, which connection would have a better latency, Wise or VISP?

Also, I'm recording how much bandwith I use this month so I can know what I should buy from Wise ( if I do get it )

Trial , we will have to think about this. Generally it is good idea.
For now installations not enough automated, so it take too much our resources, we cannot do that for now. Plus we have expirience, customer was not paying for hardware before, and then delaying payments for connection. Finally, when he got -$1000, let's say, we disconnect him. And he just tell "If u are a man, try to come, and take your hardware!".

Because of such assholes it is too risky to do trials and equipment for free.

Padre

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

when playing i never get above the bandwidth.
lol, if i said im sure, let me fix that  i never tried VISP before , but nuclear cat said that they dont have any extra place on their land lines.
as for WISE u'll have to ask them before you purchase if they can hook you on their land lines.

Pinging www.l.google.com [64.233.161.99] with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 64.233.161.99: bytes=32 time=218ms TTL=249
Reply from 64.233.161.99: bytes=32 time=266ms TTL=249
Reply from 64.233.161.99: bytes=32 time=208ms TTL=249
Reply from 64.233.161.99: bytes=32 time=208ms TTL=249

Ping statistics for 64.233.161.99:
    Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 208ms, Maximum = 266ms, Average = 225ms

Last edited by Padre (January 12 2007)

karim

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

@teodorgeorgiev: Take it easy dude. why do you have to jump on the occasion every time you reply to me and bad mouth other ppl.
I'm sorry you felt insulted, but as far as i recall, YOU told me that it would take as long as it takes for ogero to get the lines ready for DSL to reach me. I figured you were just waiting for ogero.

Anyways, I'm glad i signed with visp since they have superman working their as an "engineer".

BTW: As a lebanese, i too, feel highly insulted by your "two left hands and one big mouth." comment, but it's making me wonder who it is that has the big mouth here...

Halo

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

Wow Padre, those are nice latencies for Lebanon right there *drools*

Yeah I see what you're saying Nuclearcat about the trial because Lebanese can just steal your equipment and do 'something' with it, I don't know

teodorgeorgiev

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

Karim, if you think that what is said by me is insulting - just do not use our connection.
Go and use the connection of some other ISP, where you will just fund some political party
with your money. If you come to us, it means that you agree fully with my words (we perform better than the others).

nuclearcat

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

One this i understand now... unlimited bandwidth, perfect latency, low prices... or this ISP just begin, or he will become bankrupt very soon :-(

Halo

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

Sorry through putting you through a lot of work Padre, but what is a parabolic reflector, where can I get one, and how do I use it / how does it work? If I'm living in an area where the signal is poor, would the parabolic reflector make the signal better?

Also, can you do a traceroute to bbc.co.uk? Thanks a lot :)

Padre

Member

Re: Unlimited is not unlimited after all!

lol ok

Tracing route to bbc.co.uk [212.58.228.155]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

  1    42 ms    25 ms    24 ms  63.218.35.1
  2    29 ms    32 ms    32 ms  63-218-111-193.sdsl.cais.net [63.218.111.193]
  3     *        *        *     Request timed out.
  4   201 ms   209 ms   206 ms  so-4-0-1-nyc5.flagtel.com.144.216.62.in-addr.arp
a [62.216.144.105]
  5   193 ms   192 ms   180 ms  so-0-3-0.0.cjr02.ldn004.flagtel.com [62.216.128.
149]
  6   183 ms   180 ms   181 ms  bbc-gw0-linx.prt0.thdoe.bbc.co.uk [195.66.224.10
3]
  7   195 ms   187 ms   188 ms  212.58.238.129
  8   183 ms   180 ms   198 ms  212.58.238.33
  9   182 ms   180 ms   180 ms  pos6-0.rt0.mh.bbc.co.uk [212.58.239.30]
10   186 ms   188 ms   187 ms  virtual0.mh.bbc.co.uk [212.58.228.155]

Trace complete.

and about a parabolic reflector, it was originally designed to make wireless anthena directional so you can directt he signal into certain regions in order to increase it's strendth. altho the NexNet box's anthena is already directional, the use of the reflector did improve my signal a bit, formely from 2bars to 3bars on the box. now i got full 5, but i keep the reflector anyway :)
Just google it, u'll know how to build one

Theo man, are you receiving my PMs ?

About just starting, no, WISE has been around for 2 yrs now or a bit more, but i guess the reason of their performance is because they are politically backed.

About Trial, WISE used to offer free trial, i got my box after trying their connection for couple of weeks. but dunno if they are still offering that.
It's not a big deal, cause you can't do anything if you steal the box, they just deny it from the network, and no one will purchase it
and fuck i feel like a WISE sales man :S

Just as a footnote: NO i dont work for them, nor do i get an profit if you guys purchase anything from them.

Last edited by Padre (January 14 2007)