LebGeeks

Toufic

Member

17th of October Lebanon Revolution

This is thread to all members of this community:

As you may already know, the country is going through a radical change in recent days.
This change might be considered in history as Lebanon's new Independence.
While there could be some of you who would disagree with what is happening, to those who do agree, i urge you to put in the work in your respective fields and contribute to what is going on..

Every small contribution counts regardless of it's nature:
- you could go down and protest
- you could help by spreading the right information on social media / news outlets
- you could go down and clean with others in the morning before work
- you could communicate with people outside of Lebanon on the importance of their support
- you could get in touch with some of the civil societies and volunteer to assist in logistics
- you could give context analysis or even suggestions on how to improve
- you could explain to the neighborhood children / teenagers about why this is happening
- you could create digital content etc.

I checked the forum a couple of times and i was hoping to find a thread about this; given that i did not, i had to create one myself.
Even if this doesn't get much interaction, i urge whoever reads this to realize that we all have families, loved ones or friends who are barely making it day to day, who are struggling to get education, health care, jobs or even food... These are all basic necessities of life that we are entitled to given the amount of money we put in Lebanon.

It's why we owe it to them and to ourselves to become active in some way or form and contribute to this revolution so that this wall that was broken down can be invested for a better future by smart people like many of you on this form.

My regards to all

Johnaudi

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

Hello, the reason there isn't any thread is due to:

8. No religion or politics. This is a technology forum.

Even though you may not intend to do so, but this thread will turn into a subjective political speech.
Nevertheless, I can contribute with digital content. Would love to know where to start.

potato

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

Actually this is the best opportunity for lebgeeks community to be among this drastic change that we all hope to end in the Lebanese favor and that is all of us here. Whoever against this revolution might hate it for any reason but this time people cant stand the corruption that it gone us onto all these years. We had enough, we dont want religion to divide us. Religion is between you and God. No more sects no more corruption. All of our current leaders should resign!

rolf

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

Ah finally, we acknowledge the elephant in the room.

i urge whoever reads this to realize that we all have families, loved ones or friends who are barely making it day to day, who are struggling to get education, health care, jobs or even food... These are all basic necessities of life that we are entitled to given the amount of money we put in Lebanon.

This is why I am staying at home and trying to secure a future, work, etc. since the situation is getting from bad to worse.
You have seen how many persons are trying to leave the country.

Anyway I am all for improved living conditions in Lebanon. I dream that the country will become competitive on the international level.

I know many will disagree with me, but I think that people need to be well fed and be in good health to be in optimal shape (including peace of mind!) for creating real change. It takes time, patience and resources in my opinion.

I think a lot of the anger we are seeing is related to living in dignity and saying "no, we are not stupid".

Wishing for the best.

Last edited by rolf (October 24 2019)

dsoftware.king

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

We should all be concerned about what is happening and to support the revolution, we keep criticizing everything in this country but we never do anything about it. Here is a chance, a big one.

We shouldn’t be neutral

hkbazzi

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

Our next minister of telecommunications should be elected out of this forum

rolf

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

We should all be concerned about what is happening and to support the revolution, we keep criticizing everything in this country but we never do anything about it.

I do something about it.

Regarding the insanely loud cars and motorbikes that drive around and make donuts at random hours in the afternoon, causing me anxiety and anger:
I called 112 about 4 times and went to the police station once

Regarding the pollution and garbage problem:
I took the habit of refusing plastic bags and using re-usable bags. I pick good with the least plastic packaging. I recycle cans, organic stuff (compost), glass, paper and plastic bottles.

Regarding the diesel generators and the huge amount of pollution they produce, I tried to look (or even create) an initiative, a group of people who would want to take action for 24h electricity.

I tried to positively influence the future of the country in general by repetitively sharing my opinion on other online platforms in particular in regards to what happened this last week.

Tech Guru

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

An immediate extraordinary meeting of the House of Representatives is required to approve the "reforms points"  presented by Hariri. People should remain in the streets while maintaining the peaceful protests until the House of Representatives  adopt the reforms legislation requested by the people.

To call on the House of Representatives tomorrow to complete the law to lift banking secrecy on all of them. The authority either try to inject the " conspiracy theory"  agiants the  protesters,  that are feedup and calling for a decent life , or ride the wave with them.

#كلن_يعني _كلن

Last edited by Tech Guru (October 26 2019)

rolf

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

The authority either try to inject the " conspiracy theory"  agiants the  protesters,  that are feedup and calling for a decent life , or ride the wave with them.

#كلن_يعني _كلن

Regarding conspiracy theories, sometimes I suspect that the government is possibly even instigating and encouraging the crisis so that they can have grounds for a few billion dollars emergency loan from the IMF.

Regarding "everyone means everyone" I hope that it will also include all those who voted them in power, and anyone who benefited from corruption at one point or another, including anyone who paid bribes or benefited from a job through political connections.

I suspect that would be like 50% of Lebanon if not all of it...

How about that? Real change!

nuclearcat

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

I do something about it.

Regarding the insanely loud cars and motorbikes that drive around and make donuts at random hours in the afternoon, causing me anxiety and anger:
I called 112 about 4 times and went to the police station once

Regarding the pollution and garbage problem:
I took the habit of refusing plastic bags and using re-usable bags. I pick good with the least plastic packaging. I recycle cans, organic stuff (compost), glass, paper and plastic bottles.

Regarding the diesel generators and the huge amount of pollution they produce, I tried to look (or even create) an initiative, a group of people who would want to take action for 24h electricity.

I tried to positively influence the future of the country in general by repetitively sharing my opinion on other online platforms in particular in regards to what happened this last week.

Sidenote - as i'm foreigner, i dont have and dont want to have any political opinion on this matters.
So i just want to add on technical matters.
------
Recycling

Except doing change on ourself(i am doing that too, but only in matters that i can really send somewhere, like aluminium, cardboard paper), we need also to develop practical approach for majority of Lebanese. And handle every matter of it.
)E.g. biodegradable plastic bags often bullshit, they just lose bonding and become microplastics and pollute environment worse than HDPE/LDPE.
)Paper bags are biodegradable only without additives and they are much more expensive to produce
)Each material might have recycling limit, especially organic materials, such as plastic, paper. Aluminium and glass as i know best on matters of recycling
)We need solution against ignorant people who will not sort trash, cheat on it
)Prevent people "ride the reason" who want to put fake agenda for profit, e.g. introducing fake biodegradable materials

-----
Energy
This is my and company i am working joint efforts to reduce strain on Lebanese electrical grid

image share
This is my personal panels, and company installed also very big array, so their server room and office stays completely "green".

Sidenote: I am not a fan of solar panels, they are not sustainable energy source in global terms,but they are highly beneficial for Lebanon, because they reduce local pollution, help with overloaded grid and localizing energy generation at peak time, and make country less dependent on fossil fuel price fluctuations.

There is also many ideas how this sector can be improved, but not sure it is worthy to post here, until i complete my research on this subjects :)

samer

Admin

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

Hello, the reason there isn't any thread is due to:

8. No religion or politics. This is a technology forum.

Even though you may not intend to do so, but this thread will turn into a subjective political speech.

We will keep this topic open as long as it doesn't dwindle into politics or name-calling.

nuclearcat

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

We will keep this topic open as long as it doesn't dwindle into politics or name-calling.

IMO we need to keep topic open in any case, but might need delete bad messages, temporarily mute those, who don't want to respect the rules.
Because currently happening events might be a hope for change, so it will be nice to post ideas what can be improved technically...

Last edited by nuclearcat (October 26 2019)

Tech Guru

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

Update:

The " old song and dance"  popped out again ,  embassies injecting  money for the whole  movement. Let us drop the " conspiracy theory "  for just once. Threcorrupted  authority throw it to gradually melt down all the protests. This time it is a true revolution across all Lebanon ,  a voice for the poor and rich. The corrupted authority will utilize all the methods in the coming days to end this , including political parties injecting their thugs as what happened yesterday.

The reform paper mentions actions to be taken to fight corruption and regain the USD million being stolen. This old ways of tricks has been mentioned since 1991 ,  end of civil war. Corruption cannot end by corrupted authority.  Will they capture a minister from a political body without capturing another from another party , a one one way ?  Will they lift the immunity to ensure the honest  prosecution ? Nothing will happen ,  as if they are buying fish in water.

Last edited by Tech Guru (October 26 2019)

potato

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

The only thing i regret is that the revolution didn't use this opportunity to meet the president live in front of all people (i would make sure to stream it over youtube the dialogue or the meeting) to represent the demands of all society. If i had the guts to represent the revolution i would do it. I would name myself Lebanese Citizen and i would dress up in Lebanese flag clothes to represent the average citizen without showing my face because no one can represent the poor citizen. The question is how do they trust the people who are going to represent the revolution ?

Kareem

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

The only thing i regret is that the revolution didn't use this opportunity to meet the president live in front of all people (i would make sure to stream it over youtube the dialogue or the meeting) to represent the demands of all society. If i had the guts to represent the revolution i would do it. I would name myself Lebanese Citizen and i would dress up in Lebanese flag clothes to represent the average citizen without showing my face because no one can represent the poor citizen. The question is how do they trust the people who are going to represent the revolution ?

Something is messed up in this country. They want to change the regime yet they don't want anyone to speak on their behalf.

They should have met the president yet they don't want anyone to represent them.

The things people are asking for are not realistic  Although I support the revolution in some way, it's going to bring nothing but chaos.

Yes we live in a chaos but we're still not Syria or Iraq. You cannot change everything all of sudden. You may be able to change politicians, leaders or head of departments but you cannot change the regime.

This cannot be done without blood in the street. Every and each party in Lebanon is getting support from embassies, no exceptions but in the end, fighting corruption is one thing, and eliminating the sectarian regime is a totally different issue.

Some of  people's revolution goals are common but most of it IS NOT.  Lebanon is already divided demographically into sects, are we really sure people don't have a problem living with each other ? is it true that they're asking for a civil state ?

Last thing I remember was few months ago when muslims were not allowed to buy or even rent apartments in hadat. 

Yes there's a party that wants Lebanon without sects, without corruption and without external political affiliations and dictations but if you want my honest opinion, they are the minority.

rolf

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

Yeah I suspect many of the persons protesting are the ones who voted for the "traditional" parties.
The government is going banckrupt. Their only way out are reforms, which means laying off 10s of thousands of public sector employees.
I suspect many of these potential targets of layoff are down there protesting to topple the government.

infiniteloop

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

Our next minister of telecommunications should be elected out of this forum

Yes!
If the next government is a technocrats one, they should take a true IT specialist as minister of telecom
This ''Cedre'' thing is another epic fail dream from our politicians to ''save'' Lebanon, these 5 billions $ will be as usual split by political party.
If we want to save Lebanese's economy, they should improve the purchasing power to reboot sales , if the businesses can sell again in quantities it will greatly help the economy, so they should decrease taxes and VAT on imported products instead of increasing them

Last edited by infiniteloop (October 26 2019)

nuclearcat

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

One big issue with "true IT specialist", i noticed many groups pushing their "buddies" who will have clear conflict of interest.
It should be some expat, not involved in business and who will not involve himself in clearing part for specific market players.

vlatkozelka

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

The only thing i regret is that the revolution didn't use this opportunity to meet the president

What is the point? He's been given enough time. Does it take 2.5 million people (give or take) protesting for 10 days for him to do his freakin' job?!

This whole crew just lost it's validity (shar3ye), when more than half the people wants them out! I don't know any of my relatives/friends or even co-workers who didn't attend the protest. How are we all governed by people we reject?

but you cannot change the regime.

Why not? In my career, even the worst company I've worked with was ran better than the country is. My current company is on par with European standards. Even knowing that those companies are under outside pressure (from parties) just like the country is (from other countries). But the companies thrive because they work, not steal! What is stopping our government from working for once?

Last thing I remember was few months ago when muslims were not allowed to buy or even rent apartments in hadat.

Why bring that up?

They are the minority.

No they are not! Stop telling yourselves that

It's the older generation that's still corrupted (corrupted = ta2ifye, idk the exact word sorry), and are still trying to pass that out to the newer generation. Videos of little girls being asked "allah shou?" waiting to be answered "allah ouwwet" is a good proof.

If you go down to the streets, you'll find out that the new generation is mostly sick of the "system" the older generations put. In university they were the minority, and at work! The only corrupted people I still stumble upon are from the older generation...

It's time for the minority to step aside! We are sick of it...

Last edited by vlatkozelka (October 26 2019)

Kareem

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

Why not? In my career, even the worst company I've worked with was ran better than the country is. My current company is on par with European standards. Even knowing that those companies are under outside pressure (from parties) just like the country is (from other countries). But the companies thrive because they work, not steal! What is stopping our government from working for once?

It's not a one month job. IT HAS TO BE GRADUAL.  You CANNOT ask for such a change without doing the basics. You need to negotiate and start from new elections and new voting system. This is the first step. The parliament is what represents people. If the prime minister resigns it's fine but without a new parliament you cannot do anything. Once you have new deputies , you start planning for new laws and new changes. If you do the math, it takes at least 2 years.

And not to mention that it's the current politicians who are going to choose the new voting law and system which means back to square one.

If you can be kind enough to explain how you're planning or going to change the regime, I'm all ears....

Why bring that up?

Because it's the reality. Mind you, the old generation still constitutes a big portion of the lebanese population.

No they are not! Stop telling yourselves that

It's the older generation that's still corrupted (corrupted = ta2ifye, idk the exact word sorry), and are still trying to pass that out to the newer generation. Videos of little girls being asked "allah shou?" waiting to be answered "allah ouwwet" is a good proof.

If you go down to the streets, you'll find out that the new generation is mostly sick of the "system" the older generations put. In university they were the minority, and at work! The only corrupted people I still stumble upon are from the older generation...

It's time for the minority to step aside! We are sick of it...

I am not sure if you live in Lebanon, but if you do, and if you mean by new generation anyone under 18, then yeah you may have a point.

Last edited by Kareem (October 26 2019)

Beej

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

Nice thread, as long as it is calm as is, i do not think Samer minds.
We did this once before i cant remember, we urged Samer to keep the thread open for a while.

In any case, i am here to add something. I do not have any social media accounts, except watsup, so if it sounds good to you spread the word.

A vaccine is needed, i do not trust myself nor others, its harsh but hear me out.
If we have what we want (most of us), new elections and new election law ( i want to vote for the 128 members). During these elections they will add a lot of drama, a lot of "they are targeting us" drama, some will vote "nkaye bil tanyin"..etc. We might have some changes in the "new" parliament no more than 30% (i am being generous).

I propose this: High government positions from parliament member all the way to the president, with his/her consultants,team,..etc
can win and be elected to fill this position ONLY ONCE.

This will rid  from the "royal" democracy. give chance to others to become a member, equal chances of getting elected/hired..etc

So whomever becomes any official, he has his/her 4-6 years to do his action plan. I want to make these jobs repulsive and not to beneficiary to scare away corrupt people.

My 2 cents

rolf

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

You need to negotiate and start from new elections and new voting system. This is the first step. The parliament is what represents people. If the prime minister resigns it's fine but without a new parliament you cannot do anything. Once you have new deputies , you start planning for new laws and new changes. If you do the math, it takes at least 2 years.

I am with you. Democracy is a solid base for change and stability. Let people get what they vote for and when they are ready for it.

Because it's the reality. Mind you, the old generation still constitutes a big portion of the lebanese population.

What about the tens of thousands of public employees that were appointed due to their allegiances (most of them)? Do you think they will quietly go and sacrifice their livelyhood for the "revolution"?

Johnaudi

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

The older generation is making a joke out of this whole movement.
While partially true that certain parties are involved in the whole movement, they make up less than half the people I know that are for (being a 21-year-old university student). I do not endorse any parties, yet if their goals are the same as ours (and abiding by the people’s rules), I don't see why not allow them to Surf the wave? Although some chants may not be the most adequate against their political rivals, we can see that most of that stopped now. (the main songs came down as a particular political leader stated ’This movement is not against us and is made by a specific political party’ which added fuel to the fire)

I still don't understand why some parties are even contributing in protesting with the terms ”Kelloun ya3ne Kelloun, but not X”, what's even more disturbing is that this X contains a significant portion of the people in power, making me wonder against whom and what are they protesting in the first place. Following this logic, if the movement wants everyone out, everyone should be out. And if you believe that your politician is ’clean,’ vote for him back, it's that simple — no need to break the whole movement’s process because of your ideological subjective point of view. It's no surprise he who is doing so is majorly the elderly, alongside the brainwashed, with most of their arguments going back dozens of years. We don't live in the past anymore.

Day by day, we see improvement, from scaring them to getting them to tick some steps off our lists. Although our goals seem a bit unrealistic, they're not impossible. We may not be able to get the people’s money back, but we can at least mop some heads out.

Also, does anyone know any embassies endorsing this movement? I'd love some extra pocket money.

potato

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

EVERYONE i recommend to share your opinion why do you support the revolution ? and if not why not ? and How are you supporting the revolution ? in the end its your country and if you don't share your thought about it that means you dont care about your future and family's future since they will be governed by X leaders that may support and combat for another X country and not your country.

From my side, i fully support the revolution however its a long road and i think it should be fully organised like how honk kong is doing. Massive protest during the weekend for example. Organized over the internet and everyone could help the revolution by picking one responsibility so no burden on some people or organizers. Many people are hesitating and not joining the protests because they dont believe in change and this needs to be worked on ALOT. For example make alot of music videos that helps this issue.

Last edited by potato (October 28 2019)

nuclearcat

Member

Re: 17th of October Lebanon Revolution

Sorry, but hong kong is absolutely wrong example. They keep destructing everything around and rioting, and while business owners in HK/China can rely on insurance and state support, here the owners of the destroyed stores sooner or later will simply pick up weapons and go shoot protesters who have such habits.
Also, in HK anyone who speaks out with different opinion is getting beaten up, and his business is destroyed. Can you even imagine what it is to live in an atmosphere of terror?
Just watch https://twitter.com/liamstone_19 , it is pro-mainland account, but he supply enough credible proof how violent is this protest and how biased is media to cover it.