LebGeeks

rolf

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

The "last mile" of transferring cash into and out of Lebanon will be challenging for sure.

Although people come and go to Europe all the time, you have to find people who are worthy of trust and who are willing to take this responsibility.

An additional cost of doing business in Lebanon when we least need it.

I'm willing to travel to and from europe and anywhere you guys want me to go in exchange of paying my in and out tickets and related bills (food, commute etc..) and i will be responsible to handle this task. Imagine if this job was real :/

Forgot to add only during the weekends

Okay, so let's say

1. "customers": Lebanese who opened a bank account outside the country to keep their earned cash away from Lebanese banks. Customers will use their money + online banking or card to buy bitcoins online
2. "mules" Mules will just take a ticket to Cyprus (for example) and withdraw Euros (or USD if possible) from an external account which belongs to the "merchants".
3. "merchants" Merchants will buy bitcoins from "customers" inside Lebanon and they will buy them against USD or LBP cash at the de-facto rate

From the customer point of view: Buy bitcoins, then sell them against USD cash in Lebanon. Get access to your USD without touching the Lebanese banks.

From the merchant point of view: Buy bitcoins on the online market, then sell them in Lebanon for a profit.

From the mule point of view: Take a trip, and withdraw from the merchant's account, and bring him cash so he can buy bitcoins. Get a free trip to cyprus or whatever, and possibly a commission.

Maybe I am overthinking this - the merchant can do the "mule trip" himself.

Why am I going through bitcoins? Well, the other alternative: do you want to give your debit card to some stranger and give them the PIN code, and hope they don't rob you? (otherwise you what, break their legs?). Or maybe do you want to go and carry a big amount of cash for someone you don't know - and carry this responsibility - what if the money gets confiscated at the airport?

Last edited by rolf (December 4 2019)

nosense

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

The "last mile" of transferring cash into and out of Lebanon will be challenging for sure.

Although people come and go to Europe all the time, you have to find people who are worthy of trust and who are willing to take this responsibility.

An additional cost of doing business in Lebanon when we least need it.

I'm willing to travel to and from europe and anywhere you guys want me to go in exchange of paying my in and out tickets and related bills (food, commute etc..) and i will be responsible to handle this task. Imagine if this job was real :/

Forgot to add only during the weekends

Okay, so let's say

1. "customers": Lebanese who opened a bank account outside the country to keep their earned cash away from Lebanese banks. Customers will use their money + online banking or card to buy bitcoins online
2. "mules" Mules will just take a ticket to Cyprus (for example) and withdraw Euros (or USD if possible) from an external account which belongs to the "merchants".
3. "merchants" Merchants will buy bitcoins from "customers" inside Lebanon and they will buy them against USD or LBP cash at the de-facto rate

you will lose around 10% in fees

rolf

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

Yes. Got a better idea?
I would prefer paying 10-20% in fees to people who are trying to offer an alternative as opposed to 25% or more to Lebanese banks and that is if they accept to give you your money.

Last edited by rolf (December 4 2019)

Adnan

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

I watched on the news around an hour ago that the central bank issued to all banks to pay interests in 50% LBP and 50% in the foreign currency of the account. Couldn't find an online source yet but I watched it on MTV.

Kareem

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

I booked my flight to Cyprus this Saturday to open a bank account there and will let you know how it works. Will Try to bring $10,000 with me

That's great to know, I'm opening next week in Paris.I will see how it goes. Keep us updated.

Out of curiosity, you are going with a schengen visa ?

what are the papers required to open an account in france ? and are you going on a tourist visa ?

Believe it or not, I still can't give you the right answer. I contacted the bank ( HSBC Paris ) and they said they only need a passport which as form of ID and a bank statement in Lebanon including a proof of residency abroad.

As far as I understood, it's quite straightforward. I'm going next week to see how it goes.

rolf

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

As far as I understood, it's quite straightforward. I'm going next week to see how it goes.

In my experience, requirements vary across banks. I have never done it in France, but done it in UK and Germany.

For example in the UK I tried to open in Metro bank - they were advertising that it is easy to open an account and you can open one instantly. Well they asked for utility bills, which I did not have. Then I tried with Halifax bank, and they only asked for my passport and an address. Three days later I received my card. by mail The pin code I got directly from the bank. Or maybe it was the other way around - anyway they do verify your address.

rolf

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

Just a tip for all you remote / freelancers out there.

Lebanese citizen have visa-free access to Georgia. Also I read that you are allowed to work in Georgia as a freelancer for remote (non-Georgian) clients without a work permit. Living costs there are very low - considerably cheaper than Lebanon.

TheIlluminative

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

Just a tip for all you remote / freelancers out there.

Lebanese citizen have visa-free access to Georgia. Also I read that you are allowed to work in Georgia as a freelancer for remote (non-Georgian) clients without a work permit. Living costs there are very low - considerably cheaper than Lebanon.

Actually I was planning to go to Cyprus. Then switched my plans to Georgia. You only need a passport there to open an account.

The problem is you will need to go to Istanbul first, then Georgia (around $330 in total). But flats are quite cheap, $20/day for a very good one.

NuclearVision

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

Just a tip for all you remote / freelancers out there.

Lebanese citizen have visa-free access to Georgia. Also I read that you are allowed to work in Georgia as a freelancer for remote (non-Georgian) clients without a work permit. Living costs there are very low - considerably cheaper than Lebanon.

Actually I was planning to go to Cyprus. Then switched my plans to Georgia. You only need a passport there to open an account.

The problem is you will need to go to Istanbul first, then Georgia (around $330 in total). But flats are quite cheap, $20/day for a very good one.

330 allez-retour?

TheIlluminative

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

Yes $330 in total with Pegasus (the cheapest airline with no food or water or anything, but I don't need that, I have lounge access so it's OK). If you want to book it, don't put Beirut -> Tbilisi as the price will be around $400. But divide it to Beirut --> Istanbul and Istanbul->Tbilisi so you get 4 tickets in total, that way it will be cheaper for this one.

I remember Nakhal has direct flight to Tbilisi in summer, however the tickets cost around $450 if I remember correctly, but it's high season anyway.

rolf

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

Found this:
https://transferwise.com/gb/blog/openin … n-georgia/

user

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

I was thinking of making it a business, for a 5% fee and the client shouldering any exchange costs if any. My only concern is that it is illegal, and the other concern is, if people wire me money to my bank to withdraw(the easiest way to settle things) that it might trigger taxes for me in Canada or bring the revenue agency on me... it depends of course on the sums and the frequency, gifts are tax free I can always claim that.

I do recommend to anyone that is willing to put in the effort to open a bank account abroad, I read that cyprus would open it for you, but cypriotic banks are not that much better than Lebanese, they did cut their depositor's money before... Canada opens accounts for non residents as well, if you can get the tourist visa. But to get a debit card the account has to be in Canadian dollars.

Last edited by user (December 5 2019)

Kareem

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

After numerous fights with Blom Bank, they finally agreed to open me a new account " Fresh dolar account ". That's literally the name;...
The thing is that I can put cash money and do whatever I want with it ( 100k POS/internet/ 20k daily withdrawal  per month ).

You cannot put cheque bancaire, cheques in general, use any of your savings whatsoever. Only Cash and incoming international transfers qualify.

rolf

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

That "fresh dollar" will become rotten the moment it touches a Lebanese bank. You know that, right?

Kareem

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

That "fresh dollar" will become rotten the moment it touches a Lebanese bank. You know that, right?

Well what makes you sure ? They wouldn't have come up with this new account type if it's going to be the same.

I guess they realized that people who have cash can just go to some exchange offices and ask for money transfer. They rather take the commission and do what you want to do.

I'll start with some 10K and see how it goes. Will keep you posted.

Guitaret

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

After numerous fights with Blom Bank, they finally agreed to open me a new account " Fresh dolar account ". That's literally the name;...
The thing is that I can put cash money and do whatever I want with it ( 100k POS/internet/ 20k daily withdrawal  per month ).

You cannot put cheque bancaire, cheques in general, use any of your savings whatsoever. Only Cash and incoming international transfers qualify.

This is nice to hear and makes perfect sense to both parties. But I wouldn't recommend it to be a "thing" because it gives a very bad reputation to the finance model of the bank.
Imagine you are standing in a line where the one in front of you got accepted for a 20k cash withdrawal but you got 300$ only just because he put his money in the bank recently. This sucks big time and I would definitely start a scene if it happens to me.

Last edited by Guitaret (December 5 2019)

sero

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

After numerous fights with Blom Bank, they finally agreed to open me a new account " Fresh dolar account ". That's literally the name;...
The thing is that I can put cash money and do whatever I want with it ( 100k POS/internet/ 20k daily withdrawal  per month ).

You cannot put cheque bancaire, cheques in general, use any of your savings whatsoever. Only Cash and incoming international transfers qualify.

This is exactly what i have been told by Bank Audi, my older post:

+ If you transfer $$ from an international account to your Lebanese account there is no limit in withdrawing them in $$.
.

If you open a  Fresh dollar account and transfer USD from abroad you can withdraw your money with no limit.
I haven't done it yet. I have some doubts that if i do transfer money, the bank will change their minds (as they're daily doing) and create a new limit. what do you think?

TheIlluminative

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

After numerous fights with Blom Bank, they finally agreed to open me a new account " Fresh dolar account ". That's literally the name;...
The thing is that I can put cash money and do whatever I want with it ( 100k POS/internet/ 20k daily withdrawal  per month ).

You cannot put cheque bancaire, cheques in general, use any of your savings whatsoever. Only Cash and incoming international transfers qualify.

Why you had to fight for it if they made this new account type?

Can anyone open it? Or you have to be a customer first?

rolf

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

Well what makes you sure ? They wouldn't have come up with this new account type if it's going to be the same.

I thought that fresh dollars means they are coming directly from outside, but if cash is also considered "fresh money" then I guess maybe I was wrong.

It is good to have options - I just don't like the whole "fresh money" concept which is not new at all, by the way. Is this really what we want to deal with? 2 rates of exchange, fresh money, not-so-fresh money, and all kind of limits, and the financial crisis like we have nothing else to do with our lives!

Ok sorry for the small rant. It sounds like a good option for current expenses. However if you want to put money aside for the long term I would personally do it in an external bank account. There are many online options for investing your money and I am afraid that Lebanese banks are still far from competing with these. Just my personal opinion.

Last edited by rolf (December 5 2019)

Kareem

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

After numerous fights with Blom Bank, they finally agreed to open me a new account " Fresh dolar account ". That's literally the name;...
The thing is that I can put cash money and do whatever I want with it ( 100k POS/internet/ 20k daily withdrawal  per month ).

You cannot put cheque bancaire, cheques in general, use any of your savings whatsoever. Only Cash and incoming international transfers qualify.

Why you had to fight for it if they made this new account type?

Can anyone open it? Or you have to be a customer first?

Most banks are not opening a new account; it's a sub account and it's because I have a long history of international money transfers.

After numerous fights with Blom Bank, they finally agreed to open me a new account " Fresh dolar account ". That's literally the name;...
The thing is that I can put cash money and do whatever I want with it ( 100k POS/internet/ 20k daily withdrawal  per month ).

You cannot put cheque bancaire, cheques in general, use any of your savings whatsoever. Only Cash and incoming international transfers qualify.

This is nice to hear and makes perfect sense to both parties. But I wouldn't recommend it to be a "thing" because it gives a very bad reputation to the finance model of the bank.
Imagine you are standing in a line where the one in front of you got accepted for a 20k cash withdrawal but you got 300$ only just because he put his money in the bank recently. This sucks big time and I would definitely start a scene if it happens to me.

No no, I didn't elaborate enough... It's not a $10K at the counter... Don't even dream of it. It's a 10K on ATM machines outside Lebanon.

nuclearcat

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

Ok sorry for the small rant. It sounds like a good option for current expenses. However if you want to put money aside for the long term I would personally do it in an external bank account. There are many online options for investing your money and I am afraid that Lebanese banks are still far from competing with these. Just my personal opinion.

What will happen with your money in external account if some well known country will put sanctions on Lebanon&Lebanese?

potato

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

Anyone heard of people layed off or started getting payed in lbp currency ?
some say companies like shopandship, alfa, touch, ogero etc.. are struggling with keeping $ currency rolling in and eventually their employees will start getting payed with lbp if lets stay Lebanon will survive since the country will eventually collapse if the situation keep getting worse. If this happens very few international companies will stay in lebanese market since no benefit for them to drag themselves with this train.

Last edited by potato (December 5 2019)

Kareem

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

Anyone heard of people layed off or started getting payed in lbp currency ?
some say companies like shopandship, alfa, touch, ogero etc.. are struggling with keeping $ currency rolling in and eventually their employees will start getting payed with lbp if lets stay Lebanon will survive since the country will eventually collapse if the situation keep getting worse. If this happens very few international companies will stay in lebanese market since no benefit for them to drag themselves with this train.

Well I think they shouldn't be paid in USD in the first place. FYI the US embassy employees are paid in LBP.  Unless it's an international company that's transfering money to the country, I don't think it makes any sense to pay in USD.

Just my 2 cents...

TheIlluminative

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

I know few people who used to earn $800 (1,200,000) are getting the same amount but in LBP which means, their new salary is $600.

potato

Member

Re: Lebanese lira to USD exchange

Anyone heard of people layed off or started getting payed in lbp currency ?
some say companies like shopandship, alfa, touch, ogero etc.. are struggling with keeping $ currency rolling in and eventually their employees will start getting payed with lbp if lets stay Lebanon will survive since the country will eventually collapse if the situation keep getting worse. If this happens very few international companies will stay in lebanese market since no benefit for them to drag themselves with this train.

Well I think they shouldn't be paid in USD in the first place. FYI the US embassy employees are paid in LBP.  Unless it's an international company that's transferring money to the country, I don't think it makes any sense to pay in USD.

Just my 2 cents...

Well aub and aubmc are being payed in USD...
Ill try to explain why its not the same with all companies and you shouldve known that since u already worked with telecom companies before.

All of the quipments of these companies are brought abroad and shipped to lebanon using $ currency and all of the contracts of these companies with international companies like Ericsson/Nokia/huawei etc.. are written with $ currency. Now that being said. $ was easier for these companies to earn from customers  now that banks made it harder to get $ all of these companies had to rely on lbp since they need money at the end of the day. When you cut $ that means you cut upgrades, support, equipment, and most important thing you made these companies to stop being productive and eventually that means we are back to square one that means bad coverage, bad support for the customers. Yup bad ending in my view.

Same thing can be said for cars. You cant just go and buy a new car in lbp since its being brought in $ currency...