LebGeeks

duke-of-bytes

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Get a japanese cheap car..a honda..a hyundai..anhfhi5with cheap parts and simple mechanics
A 4 cylinders with good mileage

Salloum

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

BMWs are for drivers, not for people who want to get around. Owning a BMW is expensive because they’re not very reliable. If you don’t care about driving experience it isn’t for you

portaxeplayer

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Never buy a used German car if you're not willing to pay for its maintenance. I cringe every time I see a Merc, BMW or Audi that has an SRS, Check Engine light, etc..on the dashboard and the owner just doesn't want to pay the required amount to get it back to snuff.

I still own an E-Class from 1997 which was bought new and has been maintained at Gargour all its life, there's nothing that beats a well maintained car. Take care of the car and it will take care of you. Mercs are pretty much bulletproof in the drive train, it's all the electronics that make those car unreliable. BMWs have had engine and transmission issues ever since the early 2000s and the excessive use of plastics in critical areas in the engine bay as well as their trashy ZF transmissions.

You want rock-solid reliability go Japanese, especially Toyota & Honda.

Last edited by portaxeplayer (April 27 2019)

rolf

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Get a Toyota and an old Nokia phone.

Elitism Guru

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Get a Toyota and an old Nokia phone.

Rule 11. Immortality discussions are not allowed.

VincentKeyboard

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

I had a ton of old nokia phones including the 3310. The battery used to last at least 10 days. The only issue I had with it was the small call log size.
The last nokia phone I had was the C3 before I jumped ships to android phones.

Last edited by VincentKeyboard (April 28 2019)

rolf

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

They still make them! I have a new Nokia 105, I bought it a year ago to put my other SIM in it and see if anyone thinks about me (apparently quite a few telemarketers do).

Yes the call log is a problem I have noticed. Old calls just disappear - I guess the call log is allocated 32 bytes or something like that!

A battery charge lasts 5 days. It does not cost you $300 to repair every time it slips from your hand.

I would use Nokia as a main phone and forget about Android - but I would miss a few things:
- Whatsapp
- Maps
- Playing chess or games at home (I don't do it much outside home)

That's all, really.

Sorry I broke rule 11 again!

Last edited by rolf (April 27 2019)

Johnaudi

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Just to be clear, what is your budget? And how long will you be staying in Lebanon?

purpleradish

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

hmmm.... the good old immortal Nokia and Toyota.,Now thinking back, I have never had a Nokia or Toyota die on me. In fact, I am waiting for Nokia 9 to become available, the cameras look pretty promising, despite mixed initial reviews, most of the problems should go away with an OS update with further optimisation

Just to be clear, what is your budget? And how long will you be staying in Lebanon?

Budget will be around $10k, will need the car for about 3 years.

Don't mind paying a bit more for routine maintenance for a German car that is rear wheel drive and fun to drive. I am just worried that something expensive may break (like BMW's VANOS valves) and cost a fortune to fix.

On the other end of the spectrum, I also don't mind a cheap and cheerful Japanese or Korean car that can just zip around the city and fulfill my occasional excursion needs. Like the Yaris, Cerato or Accent. Honda City also looks pretty good, and it does appear to be slightly better equipped than others. Although Cerato is a class bigger (but it seems severely stripped down in terms of standard equipment level).

In fact, I have some fond memories driving a rental 1.6L Accent around, quite a zippy car. It wasn't the best driver's car, but it had enough go and was cheap enough so that I didn't have to worry too much. But I think the Accent in Lebanon is only 1.4L?

Johnaudi

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Buy a brand new kia from the company if you're only staying for 3 years. A nice picanto/rio will do the job as they have very low mpg. A Toyota or Nissan would do wonders for the long run, but that may be out of budget unless you're aiming for secondhand.

Salloum

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Never buy a used German car if you're not willing to pay for its maintenance. I cringe every time I see a Merc, BMW or Audi that has an SRS, Check Engine light, etc..on the dashboard and the owner just doesn't want to pay the required amount to get it back to snuff.

I still own an E-Class from 1997 which was bought new and has been maintained at Gargour all its life, there's nothing that beats a well maintained car. Take care of the car and it will take care of you. Mercs are pretty much bulletproof in the drive train, it's all the electronics that make those car unreliable. BMWs have had engine and transmission issues ever since the early 2000s and the excessive use of plastics in critical areas in the engine bay as well as their trashy ZF transmissions.

You want rock-solid reliability go Japanese, especially Toyota & Honda.

I have to disagree on your comment on the ZF transmissions, their new 8 speed on the 4 cylinder turbos is buttery smooth, too early to tell on reliability but so far so good

Aly

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Never buy a used German car if you're not willing to pay for its maintenance. I cringe every time I see a Merc, BMW or Audi that has an SRS, Check Engine light, etc..on the dashboard and the owner just doesn't want to pay the required amount to get it back to snuff.

I still own an E-Class from 1997 which was bought new and has been maintained at Gargour all its life, there's nothing that beats a well maintained car. Take care of the car and it will take care of you. Mercs are pretty much bulletproof in the drive train, it's all the electronics that make those car unreliable. BMWs have had engine and transmission issues ever since the early 2000s and the excessive use of plastics in critical areas in the engine bay as well as their trashy ZF transmissions.

You want rock-solid reliability go Japanese, especially Toyota & Honda.

I have to disagree on your comment on the ZF transmissions, their new 8 speed on the 4 cylinder turbos is buttery smooth, too early to tell on reliability but so far so good

Okay, but at some point during 1999 till 2004 or 2005 i don't remember exactly, many bmw E46 models (mostly 323) suffered from no reverse issue and it was due to bad ZF transmission. You suddenly loose the reverse functionality and you cannot go backward with your car, you will have to rebuild or replace the transmission which is of course expensive.
That problem was so frequent they even made a website for it back then (noreverse.org)

NuclearVision

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

The C4 by comparison appears to be better value, it is a lot more car for the money, and a class bigger. Not to sure about long-term reliability and resale value though. There aren't that many advertisements for used C4's, so I presume it isn't that popular of a car over there? There is a 2016 one for $12k, pretty tempting.

I drive a 10 year old C4.

Amazingly the 4 speed auto gearbox has held up so far. Outside of the gearbox being abnormally sluggish, it has only caused minor occasional trouble, as expected considering the age.

But it does show signs of wanting to fall apart and disintegrate.
Some plastic parts are brittle. I had a surprize the other day, big chunks of rubber started falling off the gearbox knob. Hot conditions in Lebanon do that. It is a French car (France being mostly a cool and flat country) and mostly made of cheap plastic.

Some say they made progress. Anyway I believe that for up to 5 years of age and even more you should be OK. If you pick a good engine/gearbox combo, it is quite enjoyable.
However the resale value will not be terrific I am sure.

My second C3 transmission as did my first, Will sometimes without any reason or notice, go into safe mode(4 speed->2speed). Never again will i own a french car, toyotas are appealing, good engineering, cheap parts, and unlike citroen, mechanics don't cringe when they see your car's logo.

Ari

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

my friend why not checking Honda civic or city ? they are small for Beirut and great for your needs. i drive a 2000 accord 4 cylinder, and i get 240km/20 liters of fuel. it has reached +270 000 k.m this month and still drives like new, everyone in my family learnt to drive on this and used it as their first car, actually i am the 10th person driving this car. Hondas are very reliable and they have cheap parts. i am considering buying a 2015 crv for my wife and kids as those are great cars for family and change my accord with a new civic. i really recommend you to check civic and city of any year. those are solid built cars.

NuclearVision

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

my friend why not checking Honda civic or city ? they are small for Beirut and great for your needs. i drive a 2000 accord 4 cylinder, and i get 240km/20 liters of fuel. it has reached +270 000 k.m this month and still drives like new, everyone in my family learnt to drive on this and used it as their first car, actually i am the 10th person driving this car. Hondas are very reliable and they have cheap parts. i am considering buying a 2015 crv for my wife and kids as those are great cars for family and change my accord with a new civic. i really recommend you to check civic and city of any year. those are solid built cars.

I agree, japanese cars are amazing, Hondas are beater cars!

Edit: I just remembered, the new civic has a very sporty look!

Last edited by NuclearVision (May 1 2019)

Ari

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

nuclearvision the new ones are amazing but not less than 16000$, his budget is less than that. he might get the new city, but not the civic

rolf

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

My second C3 transmission as did my first, Will sometimes without any reason or notice, go into safe mode(4 speed->2speed). Never again will i own a french car, toyotas are appealing, good engineering, cheap parts, and unlike citroen, mechanics don't cringe when they see your car's logo.

Mine does something like that. It goes into 3rd gear (with a bang) and stays stuck there with an error message. Limp mode. If I restart the car it works again (yay! Like Windows!).

It is not random, it does that if I make it suffer, after driving mostly uphill on a hot day, for example.

There is a technique that I found to reduce the problem.

When the car is for example in 2nd gear, and in low RPM, you will feel as if the clutch is un-coupled and there is some amount of slippage (torque converter in use). Whenever the RPM reaches 2000+ or something like that you can feel the clutch being coupled and the engine becoming directly connected to the drivetrain.

When ever it is in the low-rpm transitional period, be veeeeery gentle with the car, let it pick up speed slowly until you can feel that the clutch is fully coupled, then you can be heavy on the accelerator.

Also do not do gear changes in very high RPMs if possible. Do not change too early either because that means it will be using the torque converter too much, so you might have to use manual mode ("tiptronic") to control that.

Through driving carefully I have been able to eliminate this problem, even when I drive up the mountains, etc.

Last edited by rolf (May 2 2019)

NuclearVision

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

My second C3 transmission as did my first, Will sometimes without any reason or notice, go into safe mode(4 speed->2speed). Never again will i own a french car, toyotas are appealing, good engineering, cheap parts, and unlike citroen, mechanics don't cringe when they see your car's logo.

Mine does something like that. It goes into 3rd gear (with a bang) and stays stuck there with an error message. Limp mode. If I restart the car it works again (yay! Like Windows!).

It is not random, it does that if I make it suffer, after driving mostly uphill on a hot day, for example.

There is a technique that I found to reduce the problem.

When the car is for example in 2nd gear, and in low RPM, you will feel as if the clutch is un-coupled and there is some amount of slippage (torque converter in use). Whenever the RPM reaches 2000+ or something like that you can feel the clutch being coupled and the engine becoming directly connected to the drivetrain.

When ever it is in the low-rpm transitional period, be veeeeery gentle with the car, let it pick up speed slowly until you can feel that the clutch is fully coupled, then you can be heavy on the accelerator.

Also do not do gear changes in very high RPMs if possible. Do not change too early either because that means it will be using the torque converter too much, so you might have to use manual mode ("tiptronic") to control that.

Through driving carefully I have been able to eliminate this problem, even when I drive up the mountains, etc.

Plot twist: I drive an automatic! haha! I'm ready to get bashed.
I bought it used so i don't get to complain, but honestly, i believe french automatic transmissions in particular and transmissions in general, are the worst, my friend bought a new automatic Duster, very slippy transmission.
On the other hand, I've only rarely heard of someone having a japanese/german transmission issue, probably due to neglect.

rolf

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Plot twist: I drive an automatic! haha! I'm ready to get bashed.

Yes, me too, this advice applies to the automatic gearbox. Basically you have to drive it like a fragile manual gearbox.
Manual gearboxes are much better, surely they don't have this issue. 6 gears!

Last edited by rolf (May 2 2019)

purpleradish

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Note to self - avoid getting a French car

xazbrat

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Note to self - avoid getting a French car

lol--that should be warning to everyone.  There are a few nicer ones coming out, but reliability will always be a question mark.

And just to mention, I do have a 1.6L accent.  It has no problems going anywhere in the mountains or in the cities, even with 4 passengers and the AC going.  They are a bit harder to find--mine is a few years old and the insurance company appraises it at $11K.  I think you do need a 1.5ishL sized motor around here to get the benefit of better fuel economy and enough power to deal with the terrain.  Going with a new kia is probably is better choice that navigating your way around used cars in this country.

Anyhow, good luck and welcome to the jungle.  :)

Ari

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

BTW I just discovered that you don't pay any customs on all electric cars, away not getting an e golf 2016. They are around 12000$ in the states and add 2000 for registration. Boom you have an electric car! I am considering one to be frank

sero

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

BTW I just discovered that you don't pay any customs on all electric cars, away not getting an e golf 2016. They are around 12000$ in the states and add 2000 for registration. Boom you have an electric car! I am considering one to be frank.

+2000 shipping fees
I would wait a couple more years to get an e car
IMO Lebanon is not yet ready for e cars
- very few charging stations
- mechanics are not yet experienced in fixing e cars
- we have no experience on how efficient they are in Lebanon (traffic, mountains, bad roads...)
- last time checked, insurance rate is very high for e cars
- e car parts are rare to find

rolf

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Note to self - avoid getting a French car

I won't argue, I would just say that if you get the right engine / transmission combination on a sporty model they are generally fun to drive an safe.

Also the basic utilitarian ones are cheap and reliable, such as vans. But you're not looking for a transport van, are you?

French electronics...

So anyway, insider tip: I spoke to someone who picks up broken cars for a living, and he said that when he picks up a Kia, it is usually due to an accident, not a fault.

To be fair it might have to do with the fact that Kia cars are usually imported new whereas other brands can be brought in old and used, with a bunch of problems.

NuclearVision

Member

Re: Moving to Beirut, getting a secondhand car

Guys does anybody have personal experience with the rising chinese car market in lebanon?