LebGeeks

rtwo2008

Member

Games Development

For all concerned,

A new company is forming a team for games development.
Depending on the local market skillset it will either be AAA titles or a variation thereof.
In the beginning it will be on a project basis to test out the team members; so don't quit your day jobs yet.
They are primarily looking for Unity3D developers (coding side more than the 3D graphics) in order to deliver products on multiple platforms.

On another note, for anyone who can contribute this info it would be appreciated:
Seeing that we don't really have any games development history in Lebanon, and consequently the local software developers don't have any experience in games development; is it possible to expect AAA titles to be done?

Last edited by rtwo2008 (September 2 2015)

jsaade

Member

Re: Games Development

AAA games usually mean large teams of artists and developers.
So unless the company can handle the hiring I would not expect AAA.
As for talent, some already exist in the market.

rtwo2008

Member

Re: Games Development

AAA games usually mean large teams of artists and developers.
So unless the company can handle the hiring I would not expect AAA.
As for talent, some already exist in the market.

Agreed for large teams. Regarding the existing talent, can you suggest or point me to someone? Freelancers or already employed?
Thanks

Satfoun

Banned

Re: Games Development

Could an architecture student at Alba help in the designing process?!
I dnt have much experiece in the coding side, but i am a gamer who admires every game sice i was 4years old
And i got lately a gaming pc,strux gtx980, and using the Unreal engine 4 to render my projects.
I always wanted to have part in game developement, and i would love to, as it is a Lebanese one

Last edited by Satfoun (September 2 2015)

Anthony2000

Member

Re: Games Development

been using unity since 2012, so i know my way around it + i know some light java scripting, would love to contribute and help in anyway possible, though do consider that i am only 15 and never taken java courses in my life, self taught by reading scripts and understanding them + the infinite knowledge on the interwebs. lol

Johnaudi

Member

Re: Games Development

I don't expect well made AAA titles to be done in Lebanon, since the only successful AAA titles are done by the big companies (EA etc).
Though I'd like to see some Lebanese maps in several FPS's.

rtwo2008

Member

Re: Games Development

Could an architecture student at Alba help in the designing process?!
I dnt have much experiece in the coding side, but i am a gamer who admires every game sice i was 4years old
And i got lately a gaming pc,strux gtx980, and using the Unreal engine 4 to render my projects.
I always wanted to have part in game developement, and i would love to, as it is a Lebanese one

Sure, but probably not in the early stages.

been using unity since 2012, so i know my way around it + i know some light java scripting, would love to contribute and help in anyway possible, though do consider that i am only 15 and never taken java courses in my life, self taught by reading scripts and understanding them + the infinite knowledge on the interwebs. lol

Since you cannot legally work with us, we could find a freelance arrangement with parents' permission. We will discuss it further, but definitely after we find the core of our team.

I don't expect well made AAA titles to be done in Lebanon, since the only successful AAA titles are done by the big companies (EA etc).
Though I'd like to see some Lebanese maps in several FPS's.

It is possible, if we reuse code efficiently, buy existing 3D models, and simply be smart about it.

Satfoun

Banned

Re: Games Development

Well it would be my honor then to work in a Lebanese game development company
And i would like to keep updated about any news regarding it
An AAA cannot be achieved now, maybe start with something more small,publish it on steam if it was for PC

jsaade

Member

Re: Games Development

I think you have a miss understanding of AAA.

Anthony2000

Member

Re: Games Development

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AAA_%28vi … ndustry%29

Definitely not AAA, doesn't have to be, start with an indie-ish game and see how it works out, don't have to go big on the first try, but that's just my opinion.

Last edited by Anthony2000 (September 5 2015)

Freddy98

Member

Re: Games Development

I would really love to contribute to this project , but can't because I'm still under 18 . Well , if you have really talented designers and programmers , you can achieve a lot . Look a The Forest , it's an impressive game with nice graphics , AI and gameplay , and it is done by just four people .  Unturned is one of the most popular games currently on steam , and it is made by just one 16 old kid . I have written my own small 3D game engine in the past 2 years ,  learned some Unity a month ago , and now I'm using Unreal Engine 4 to create my first game in my spare time . There are a lot of open source tools to make the process a lot easier , like Blender , GIMP , MakeHuman(in which you can create AAA lifelike characters ! ) , LMMS to create music ... You can get free textures from http://www.cgtextures.com/  , buy a license for  SpeedTree (used in a lot of AAA games like Battlefield 4 , Assassin's Creed) for just 20$/month , and the unity marketplace is full of nice assets . You can also do some motion capture if you have a Kinect lying somewhere in your house using Brekel (still you need 2 or 3 kinects to get some nice results) . Really , the possibilities are endless , you just need TIME and talent .
Sorry if I went a little bit off topic , but I wanted to share some of the tools I'm using in my own project because ,  well , I wish we could have a great game company here  in Lebanon .GOOD LUCK !!

Last edited by Freddy98 (September 12 2015)

rtwo2008

Member

Re: Games Development

I would really love to contribute to this project , but can't because I'm still under 18 . Well , if you have really talented designers and programmers , you can achieve a lot . Look a The Forest , it's an impressive game with nice graphics , AI and gameplay , and it is done by just four people .  Unturned is one of the most popular games currently on steam , and it is made by just one 16 old kid .
GOOD LUCK !!

Thank you for your uplifting reply. I'm saying this because I've had mostly negative feedback about this endeavor. I think people are too influenced by USA and similar places and expecting some multimillionaire corporation to get formed and dump its wealth in the games production market, with relatively high salaries and techcrunch interviews. Even as a hardcore gamer myself, if I had millions or could raise millions somehow, I'd go into real estate or some type of commerce in Lebanon/Dubai instead.

I appreciate your tips,  some we are already doing, others are new like makehuman,  will try it.

AAA games (prior to launch) are the ones that have huge development budgets. AAA games at launch or after are the ones that get positive reviews from industry critics  and become bestsellers (regardless of their budgets). So maybe I didn't specify in what stage I was hoping to expect AAA status.

Anthony2000

Member

Re: Games Development

I would really love to contribute to this project , but can't because I'm still under 18 . Well , if you have really talented designers and programmers , you can achieve a lot . Look a The Forest , it's an impressive game with nice graphics , AI and gameplay , and it is done by just four people .  Unturned is one of the most popular games currently on steam , and it is made by just one 16 old kid . I have written my own small 3D game engine in the past 2 years ,  learned some Unity a month ago , and now I'm using Unreal Engine 4 to create my first game in my spare time . There are a lot of open source tools to make the process a lot easier , like Blender , GIMP , MakeHuman(in which you can create AAA lifelike characters ! ) , LMMS to create music ... You can get free textures from http://www.cgtextures.com/  , buy a license for  SpeedTree (used in a lot of AAA games like Battlefield 4 , Assassin's Creed) for just 20$/month , and the unity marketplace is full of nice assets . You can also do some motion capture if you have a Kinect lying somewhere in your house using Brekel (still you need 2 or 3 kinects to get some nice results) . Really , the possibilities are endless , you just need TIME and talent .
Sorry if I went a little bit off topic , but I wanted to share some of the tools I'm using in my own project because ,  well , I wish we could have a great game company here  in Lebanon .GOOD LUCK !!

Thank you for your very informative post! Always had a hard time finding suitable music for my games, looks like LMMS will prove useful!

Johnaudi

Member

Re: Games Development

@Freddy technically you aren't able to finance and build an AAA company-class game by your own. You'd have a purchase a license on each and every tool you'd need to use, as well as legal work to maintain copyrights etc.

Maybe us LebGeeks should startup a project all together on GitHub, with no age restrictions (some of us are still teenagers, including myself)

We'd need an idea and a set up, but definitely not AAA at first glance.

Anthony2000

Member

Re: Games Development

@Freddy technically you aren't able to finance and build an AAA company-class game by your own. You'd have a purchase a license on each and every tool you'd need to use, as well as legal work to maintain copyrights etc.

Maybe us LebGeeks should startup a project all together on GitHub, with no age restrictions (some of us are still teenagers, including myself)

We'd need an idea and a set up, but definitely not AAA at first glance.

Agreed, but do you still have to pay a license for open source stuff like LMMS for example?

Johnaudi

Member

Re: Games Development

Agreed, but do you still have to pay a license for open source stuff like LMMS for example?

No, unless you want to purchase extra samples and use them in your soundtrack.

Freddy98

Member

Re: Games Development

Of course one alone cannot create a AAA game , and I never meant that in my post . But one can build a very successful game with some good enough graphics and gameplay ( not from the first try ) ,  especially that unity and unreal engine have become really cheap  . Of course you still need a big studio with experienced members  if you want to have state of the art graphics , animation , cinematics , and character development , but these are not mandatory for the success of a game .

I think there isn't a clear definition of "AAA" : some consider that Minecraft has become a triple A game , other leave the title for games like Battlefield , The Last of Us and such games .

Last edited by Freddy98 (September 12 2015)

rtwo2008

Member

Re: Games Development

AAA games (prior to launch) are the ones that have huge development budgets. AAA games at launch or after are the ones that get positive reviews from industry critics  and become bestsellers (regardless of their budgets). So maybe I didn't specify in what stage I was hoping to expect AAA status.

I'm going to quote myself as it seems people are not reading that part.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AAA_(video_game_industry)

" In the video game industry, AAA (pronounced "triple A") is a classification term used for games with the highest development budgets and levels of promotion ---> or the highest ratings by a consensus of professional reviewers.<--- A title considered to be AAA is therefore expected to be a high quality game or to be among the year's bestsellers. For a title to remain AAA post-launch, it must be either commercially or critically successful."

jsaade

Member

Re: Games Development

You got that wrong, you cannot have a low budget game become AAA. The article clearly mentions: "For a title to remain AAA post-launch, it must be either commercially or critically successful."

So it has to start as AAA which means a large budget for production and marketing.

Now of course in our region the budgets are not those of US. But you should expect a few hundred thousands.

rtwo2008

Member

Re: Games Development

You got that wrong, you cannot have a low budget game become AAA. The article clearly mentions: "For a title to remain AAA post-launch, it must be either commercially or critically successful."

So it has to start as AAA which means a large budget for production and marketing.

Now of course in our region the budgets are not those of US. But you should expect a few hundred thousands.

From this part: "or the highest ratings by a consensus of professional reviewers." I got the impression that during video gameplay trailers, beta testing, or pre-release, professional reviewers would give it a mark boosting it to AAA or not.

However, I might be wrong because I am dissecting a simple wiki statement. There is also always the case where AAA is not really a classification, it is just a word that big companies give their products to make them sound fancy. Maybe we can come up with a new naming like AA which means a very well built game on a low budget.

Last edited by rtwo2008 (September 14 2015)

Elied

Member

Re: Games Development

Why is a name even needed ? I know this is off-topic but all you've been talking about in this thread is laregely wether it can be called AAA. This is not what should be the main concern here. As an avid gamer myself I'm praying for this project to be successful so please leave all the naming and non sense for later and make this happen !

Anthony2000

Member

Re: Games Development

Why is a name even needed ? I know this is off-topic but all you've been talking about in this thread is laregely wether it can be called AAA. This is not what should be the main concern here. As an avid gamer myself I'm praying for this project to be successful so please leave all the naming and non sense for later and make this happen !

Took the words right out of my mouth.

rtwo2008

Member

Re: Games Development

Why is a name even needed ? I know this is off-topic but all you've been talking about in this thread is laregely wether it can be called AAA. This is not what should be the main concern here. As an avid gamer myself I'm praying for this project to be successful so please leave all the naming and non sense for later and make this happen !

Yes it's just talk, recruitment and design is happening in parallel. No worries it will be successful.

eliminator

Member

Re: Games Development

On another note, for anyone who can contribute this info it would be appreciated:
Seeing that we don't really have any games development history in Lebanon, and consequently the local software developers don't have any experience in games development; is it possible to expect AAA titles to be done?

Hello,
1 - IMHO, your should approach this differently. Marketing is 80% and promoting your game is crucial before any technical feasibility study. Any game studio or indie game dev taking game dev seriously is going to tell you that getting the word out is the toughest thing about your game whether it is a AAA or not.

2 - We actually have good game development studios in Lebanon, I can name (listing them here is against forum promotion rules) at least 4 studios that made relatively successful mobile games, and at least 3 indie game devs who takes this seriously. No offense to you, but the fact that you don't know them, doesn't mean they do no exist.

3 - Where are you going to get your budget? A small google, will tell you that one of those Lebanese companies through more than 50000$ on marketing.

4 - Who is the audience of your AAA game? International ? Arab World?  Lebanon?

Source: Check point 2 :)

rtwo2008

Member

Re: Games Development

On another note, for anyone who can contribute this info it would be appreciated:
Seeing that we don't really have any games development history in Lebanon, and consequently the local software developers don't have any experience in games development; is it possible to expect AAA titles to be done?

Hello,
1 - IMHO, your should approach this differently. Marketing is 80% and promoting your game is crucial before any technical feasibility study. Any game studio or indie game dev taking game dev seriously is going to tell you that getting the word out is the toughest thing about your game whether it is a AAA or not.

2 - We actually have good game development studios in Lebanon, I can name (listing them here is against forum promotion rules) at least 4 studios that made relatively successful mobile games, and at least 3 indie game devs who takes this seriously. No offense to you, but the fact that you don't know them, doesn't mean they do no exist.

3 - Where are you going to get your budget? A small google, will tell you that one of those Lebanese companies through more than 50000$ on marketing.

4 - Who is the audience of your AAA game? International ? Arab World?  Lebanon?

Source: Check point 2 :)

Thank you for your reply.

Yes we know about the marketing budget. Big studios in USA spend more than 100 million dollars on marketing for their AAA games. But there are many factors that increase the price so high. I won't go into details now.

I only know 2 game development studios in Lebanon, can you private message me the names?

We do have a budget obviously, but it is private and I didn't mention it. I think when someone reads such a post on Lebgeeks forum he/she automatically thinks of a teenager who loves to play games so much that he/she thinks the next step is making them. And Macdonalding his/her way through summer for some pocketmoney they call budget.

Audience is international. But this is internal information that was not shared publicly, only in private messages with interested individuals.
There are even more questions of that sort that are also internal, like game genre, game medium, expected release date, etc...

EDIT:

The problem we are facing is the possible of lack of talent. Big companies (even in other fields) are not opening in Lebanon due to many problems including:
1- Bad Transportation infrastructure and traffic that limits how many meetings you can do per day (multiply that by 365 and you can get an idea how many business prospects you can have).
2- Lack of tax free zones.
3- Inadequate telecom connectivity limiting cloud storage and collaboration with teams who are far from them.
4- Lack of talent in advanced specializations. I guess we have alot of passe-partout people here and little specializations because of the situation.
5- (The security situation, but not always).

Points 1/2/3/ can be managed but 4/ translates into a problem for us as out of a dozen software developers contacted, almost no one had heard of Unity3d...

Last edited by rtwo2008 (September 14 2015)