This is my first week in college, and I've started with Math 101. I've been wanting to get into Computer Science since high school, and Math 101 is one requirement for it. Anyways, I realized this week that I forgot most of what I learn last year. Not most, actually, but like I forgot a lot of the rules, properties, and equations over the summer. This meant that I had to go back into my math notes I took in high school and freshen up on these equations and properties. I did and it worked out and I could do the problems assigned last night. So I realized that the only way I can remember rules and properties is if I work with them, which I'll be doing this semester, and the next. But does this mean I'm bad at math? Are good math students expected to know/memorize all equations and properties at ALL times? Because I heard Computer Science demands good math students, and I really want to major in it.
Does this mean I'm bad at math?
No you're not bad at Math. As long as you can solve the problems when the equations/formulas are available, then you're okey. Looking at a "cheat sheet" is not cheating...
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I forgot the quadratic rule just this week (well actually tried to remember it but couldn't).
That's just before my 23 birthday. I am ashamed. Don't forget your math. Though, I could solve it using the completing the squares rule. Most of the math I know now is related to computer science.
Just make sure you always know your way back to the fundamentals and be able to derive them. The body of math, and the structure is much more valuable than the rules themselves. Once you learn how they're connected, you'll automatically know it all and be able to replicate it subconsciously across problems.
Summary: Forgot a rule, go back one level lower, try to derive it, relook at the derivation from someone, connect the dots. Once you do that, you don't even need to try to memorize or understand it. It just pops itself into your system. That's how I personally roll with math.
That's just before my 23 birthday. I am ashamed. Don't forget your math. Though, I could solve it using the completing the squares rule. Most of the math I know now is related to computer science.
Just make sure you always know your way back to the fundamentals and be able to derive them. The body of math, and the structure is much more valuable than the rules themselves. Once you learn how they're connected, you'll automatically know it all and be able to replicate it subconsciously across problems.
Summary: Forgot a rule, go back one level lower, try to derive it, relook at the derivation from someone, connect the dots. Once you do that, you don't even need to try to memorize or understand it. It just pops itself into your system. That's how I personally roll with math.
I fail to see why being good at math would be a prerequisite to being good at computer sciences.
That makes two of us. I was NEVER good at math, but that doesn't mean I'm not good when it comes to programing and problem solving.rolf wroteI fail to see why being good at math would be a prerequisite to being good at computer sciences.
You're gonna anger xterm ...rolf wroteI fail to see why being good at math would be a prerequisite to being good at computer sciences.
Well im sorry for you guys, math is easy just use your head ....
psst im not talking to you :P
psst im not talking to you :P
@rolf and @kassem: The simple truth is that theorem proving and computer programs are not only similar, but are exactly the same. I do not want to know how it is not to know or like math.
Video codecs, Graphics and Rasterization, Networking, Information Theory, Relational Algebra, The theory of computation itself are all mathematical theories before being computer science.
Software Production can be detached from Computer Science. It's much like comparing a Mechanical Engineer to plumber. Give one's problem to the other and you're sure to hit a catastrophe.
Video codecs, Graphics and Rasterization, Networking, Information Theory, Relational Algebra, The theory of computation itself are all mathematical theories before being computer science.
Software Production can be detached from Computer Science. It's much like comparing a Mechanical Engineer to plumber. Give one's problem to the other and you're sure to hit a catastrophe.
Learning C++ in my Engineering program required that I know math pretty well since it was centered around numerical methods and computer-aided analysis.
Tbh i'm stuck in the same situation as well, just registered for computer science in english at fanaar; they like to call it ma3loumatiyya or something of the sorts (no idea :P).
I've been told that the first year is very math / physics intensive... and i'm just wondering to myself why. I've been working on C++ for around a week now, its very enjoyable and the math is very simple, so I was just wondering to myself why they need to stress so much on things like triple integrals bla bla, when the language itself is much simpler.
Only thing I was interested in is programming, not another 3 years of theoretical math and equations which are completely useless. So if this is what they plan to do then I consider it a major waste of time, solo learning would be much more effective if you just focus on the programming languages (Namely C++, C#)
Comments? ^^
I've been told that the first year is very math / physics intensive... and i'm just wondering to myself why. I've been working on C++ for around a week now, its very enjoyable and the math is very simple, so I was just wondering to myself why they need to stress so much on things like triple integrals bla bla, when the language itself is much simpler.
Only thing I was interested in is programming, not another 3 years of theoretical math and equations which are completely useless. So if this is what they plan to do then I consider it a major waste of time, solo learning would be much more effective if you just focus on the programming languages (Namely C++, C#)
Comments? ^^
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Well I just would like to say something, computer science != programming , a person with a computer science degree is not supposed to be just a programmer but a scientist and that is obvious from the name of the major. There is a difference between majoring between computer science and computer programming.
Of course a computer science graduate can easily work as a programmer but he should have the ability to work more as a scientist who does research and creates frameworks and a base for the programmer to continue on with it. The base of computing is mathematics, we don't deal with that in our daily programming because scientists already paved the way for us. Computer scientists are supposed to design and write compilers, operating systems, database management systems, search engines, graphics libraries etc... and this stuff needs lots of maths. For example you are supposed to learn relational algebra because without it a scientist cant create a DBMS for other programmers to use.
So yes, there is a difference. If all what you are looking for is to develop websites, consume APIs, and write data driven programs in C# and link them to sql server databases, then you don't really need to be a computer scientist to do that, with hard work and dedication you can learn on your own.
Computer science is a mathematical science and not just computer programming. :)
Edit: I suggest checking out this article.
Of course a computer science graduate can easily work as a programmer but he should have the ability to work more as a scientist who does research and creates frameworks and a base for the programmer to continue on with it. The base of computing is mathematics, we don't deal with that in our daily programming because scientists already paved the way for us. Computer scientists are supposed to design and write compilers, operating systems, database management systems, search engines, graphics libraries etc... and this stuff needs lots of maths. For example you are supposed to learn relational algebra because without it a scientist cant create a DBMS for other programmers to use.
So yes, there is a difference. If all what you are looking for is to develop websites, consume APIs, and write data driven programs in C# and link them to sql server databases, then you don't really need to be a computer scientist to do that, with hard work and dedication you can learn on your own.
Computer science is a mathematical science and not just computer programming. :)
Edit: I suggest checking out this article.
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see you there GeorgeN :p I'm in my third year now french but since your English we're on the same floor :P, you just have to stay alive and not give up hope (or get bored), cause there are so many theoretical stuff in the first 2 years.
we had this discussion so many times in class last year and always doctors (especially the algebra one) where like : "we tried to reduce the maximum math we can but we cannot do more" , and one of our programing doc was like : "Math is the most important thing to evolve and go far" and his course started with some pure fucking logic math concepts that we somehow used in the extra he gave to the course.
i still can't understand the relation between math and programing (i need more experience for sure) but for now i think you will use math according to the type of the program you are building ; making a game for sure require more math and some physics than making a normal webpage.
we had this discussion so many times in class last year and always doctors (especially the algebra one) where like : "we tried to reduce the maximum math we can but we cannot do more" , and one of our programing doc was like : "Math is the most important thing to evolve and go far" and his course started with some pure fucking logic math concepts that we somehow used in the extra he gave to the course.
i still can't understand the relation between math and programing (i need more experience for sure) but for now i think you will use math according to the type of the program you are building ; making a game for sure require more math and some physics than making a normal webpage.
Thanks, I feel much better now.arithma wroteSoftware Production can be detached from Computer Science. It's much like comparing a Mechanical Engineer to plumber.
Don't study computer science in Lebanon
Don't work in computer science in Lebanon
It's bad career wise in Lebanon
You'll reach a point where you're expecting a high salary that no one can give or has the work for. At that point, if you're too ambitious, you'll quit your job seeking better opportunities that will end up being abroad, or you may want to start something of your own? Welcome to the void!
The lebanese software companies are just hopeless, and most if not all of the big software companies don't do software development in Lebanon.
Think twice before choosing computer science in Lebanon. If I go back in time now I'd have chosen some pure/real engineering degree. Programming can be easily acquired, computer science is just 1 or 2 more courses.. analysis of algorithms / theory of computation...
Don't work in computer science in Lebanon
It's bad career wise in Lebanon
You'll reach a point where you're expecting a high salary that no one can give or has the work for. At that point, if you're too ambitious, you'll quit your job seeking better opportunities that will end up being abroad, or you may want to start something of your own? Welcome to the void!
The lebanese software companies are just hopeless, and most if not all of the big software companies don't do software development in Lebanon.
Think twice before choosing computer science in Lebanon. If I go back in time now I'd have chosen some pure/real engineering degree. Programming can be easily acquired, computer science is just 1 or 2 more courses.. analysis of algorithms / theory of computation...
Reminder for everybody: Don't go off topic. This thread is about studying math during the first years of college.
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This topic is so dear to my heart that i have so many things to say about it, though little more than what arithma and AymanFarhat have already said and i couldn't have said it better myself. I'll try to keep it very simple.
Math is the foundation on which computer science is built. What's even better, is that everything that you do in life can be interpreted by simple formulas, whether walking, eating, drinking, playing or whatnot. For that matter, you can also throw in Physics for that matter as it is the essential core of rules in the universe.
Do you need to be good at math to be a successful Programmer? No.
Do you need to be good at math to be a successful Computer Scientist? Yes.
The three amazing things that were said in this topic are:
Truly folks, you are doing math without knowing it when you are programming, it's just that imperative programming shields you from having to perceive it as mathematical which is such a bad thing. Think of it this way.
function doSomething { for(i=0;i<10;i++) { //do something with i } }
wouldn't this be: f = Sigma(0 -> 10) g(i) where g = //do something with i ?
As simple as this might seem, it is proof that even control structures can be interpreted into mathematical formulas.
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Yes, you will forget your math, hell you'll probably forget all of it if you're not following up with it. I forgot most of it, but as arithma said i can always derive.
Just the other day, rahmu and myself were having a discussion on Google Talk when he brought up a problem he solved. I tried to come up with a solution to it but failed. Incidentally he pointed out a few things and the solution just ringed a bell. It was a direct application of the Fibonacci series.
Although it is never that simple, you'll be needing math alot of times. Discreet Mathematics is the most you'll ever face followed closely by linear algebra, differential equations and multi dimensional calculus.
I do hope you understand how important this is, i do have several cases where i needed a math professor to help me solve a programming related task, but i'll save those for later. If you want some quick samples, you can take a look at arithma's blog, do you think he was remotely capable of doing what he has done without applying strict physics and mathematical formulas? Does his work not apply in the real world?
Focus on your math and physics when you're in college, programming gets easy with practice.
Edit: You don't need to be a chef to eat food, but you need to be a chef to cook food.
Math is the foundation on which computer science is built. What's even better, is that everything that you do in life can be interpreted by simple formulas, whether walking, eating, drinking, playing or whatnot. For that matter, you can also throw in Physics for that matter as it is the essential core of rules in the universe.
Do you need to be good at math to be a successful Programmer? No.
Do you need to be good at math to be a successful Computer Scientist? Yes.
The three amazing things that were said in this topic are:
AymanFarhat wroteSo yes, there is a difference. If all what you are looking for is to develop websites, consume APIs, and write data driven programs in C# and link them to sql server databases, then you don't really need to be a computer scientist to do that, with hard work and dedication you can learn on your own.
and finally,arithma wroteSoftware Production can be detached from Computer Science.
GN90, you should applaud your professor for saying such a thing and acting upon it. At a certain point in your CS career you will start facing complex problems that can only be solved by applying math. For now, just take my word for it and focus on your math.GN90 wroteone of our programing doc was like : "Math is the most important thing to evolve and go far" and his course started with some pure fucking logic math concepts that we somehow used in the extra he gave to the course.
Truly folks, you are doing math without knowing it when you are programming, it's just that imperative programming shields you from having to perceive it as mathematical which is such a bad thing. Think of it this way.
function doSomething { for(i=0;i<10;i++) { //do something with i } }
wouldn't this be: f = Sigma(0 -> 10) g(i) where g = //do something with i ?
As simple as this might seem, it is proof that even control structures can be interpreted into mathematical formulas.
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Yes, you will forget your math, hell you'll probably forget all of it if you're not following up with it. I forgot most of it, but as arithma said i can always derive.
Just the other day, rahmu and myself were having a discussion on Google Talk when he brought up a problem he solved. I tried to come up with a solution to it but failed. Incidentally he pointed out a few things and the solution just ringed a bell. It was a direct application of the Fibonacci series.
Although it is never that simple, you'll be needing math alot of times. Discreet Mathematics is the most you'll ever face followed closely by linear algebra, differential equations and multi dimensional calculus.
I do hope you understand how important this is, i do have several cases where i needed a math professor to help me solve a programming related task, but i'll save those for later. If you want some quick samples, you can take a look at arithma's blog, do you think he was remotely capable of doing what he has done without applying strict physics and mathematical formulas? Does his work not apply in the real world?
Focus on your math and physics when you're in college, programming gets easy with practice.
Edit: You don't need to be a chef to eat food, but you need to be a chef to cook food.
Woah... Alright. Thanks for you replies, guys. I'm going to go through this year with the aim of getting into CS and see how my grades come out. If I get above an 85 in maths, I'll continue with CS for sure. If I get lower, I'll have to think about it that summer.